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Trees and Climate Change

Hi there,was hoping to start a discussion on what peoples views/experiences are with regards to planting trees and indeed all plants and the issue of a changing climate.It seems to me that there are two basic points: 1: do we plant plants of a local provenance that will be in ecological context with their surroundings and therefore better prepared for the pressures of a changing climate? . . . Or 2: Do we plant plants that are better suited to the conditions that a changing climate will present?The current view tends to be the former, but the Trees and Design Action Group have a web application that allows you to select trees based on certian criteria that are suited to a changing climate which may mean that people are thinking towards that latter. Indeed a warmer climate allows for a greater number of species to have a presence here in the UK, and as we know from the work of James Lovelock 'increased diversity means increased stability of a system'One associated problem is that pests and diseases will be quicker to capitalise on changing climate condtions, and the import of foreign plant material increases the risk of new pests and diseases entering the country eg. the Oak Processionary moth that entered the UK in 2007. These factors will put a huge amount of pressure on our native tree stock.Of course there is also the important issue of using planting to mitigate against changes in local climatic conditions eg. trees to combat the urban heat island effect.Anythoughts would be good,Cheers,Andy DixonTreeWise - Cornwall Sustainable Landscapes

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  • Stick to the local provenance for now. Certainly the envisaged actual change is still questionable, well according to the media - who have been quoting merrily that we are likely to see a French / North Spain climate and as such should all be looking to growing vines - all the real scientists are agreed on the fact that whilst the temperature may be comparable with such zones, the actual weather will not be - it is going to get wet and stay wet with many more large scale weather events.
    We need to plant as many native trees as possible, they need to be much more regionally applicable even than the current provenance zones set out by the FC. The localised soils need to match the species.
    On top of this major planting of conifers is required as well as coppice. Coppice will be as it has been since man colonised areas 10000 years ago up until only 100 years ago the only significant energy supply for heating and traditional purposes, dung come a close second.
    I am always at a loss to understand the lack of planting trees in urban settings - the value of a tree blog goes into this area a bit - and the compelling research into the matter is impossible to ignore. But the powers that be do not want this principally because of CCTV.
  • By the way - have Cornwall Sustainable Landscapes taken over completely down there?. Great business model - is the client base as green minded as the cooperative is or is it a case of having to convince them?.
  • Indeed, future weather is difficult to predict. Computer models are sophisticated but as Simon Proctor (local tree officer) says not predictive. The problem I believe is accuratley modelling cloud patterns. Another problem with native trees is that there arent that many of them, aroung 60 species....

    Andy

    Hamish said:
    Stick to the local provenance for now. Certainly the envisaged actual change is still questionable, well according to the media - who have been quoting merrily that we are likely to see a French / North Spain climate and as such should all be looking to growing vines - all the real scientists are agreed on the fact that whilst the temperature may be comparable with such zones, the actual weather will not be - it is going to get wet and stay wet with many more large scale weather events.
    We need to plant as many native trees as possible, they need to be much more regionally applicable even than the current provenance zones set out by the FC. The localised soils need to match the species.
    On top of this major planting of conifers is required as well as coppice. Coppice will be as it has been since man colonised areas 10000 years ago up until only 100 years ago the only significant energy supply for heating and traditional purposes, dung come a close second.
    I am always at a loss to understand the lack of planting trees in urban settings - the value of a tree blog goes into this area a bit - and the compelling research into the matter is impossible to ignore. But the powers that be do not want this principally because of CCTV.
  • I am new to cornwall landscapers so cant comment on the clients! I will be running a tree team for the co-op and our environmental policy is very important to us. Hopefully it is something that clients will appreciate...

    Andy

    Hamish said:
    By the way - have Cornwall Sustainable Landscapes taken over completely down there?. Great business model - is the client base as green minded as the cooperative is or is it a case of having to convince them?.
  • I can assume that Cornwall is similar to the Highlands with the fact that those who live here have to by definition be more environmentally aware, certainly the sustainable model is one of the best ways to go in a rural set up.

    Personally I believe the climate change is here - the swing south of the prevailing rains and wind has been in place now for three years. We have to lump it. Ignore the politicians they will never do anything particularly the latest crowd, loads to say but totally inefficient. But industry is well on track and we have to be optimistic. (we will all be dead of swine flu before it is a real problem anyway).

    60 of the best, and what a range in my opinion.
  • Hi, good discussion!
    A Forestry Commission bulletin (Creating New Native Woodlands) from the mid 90’s encouraged the conservation of local genetic distinctiveness and diversity through planting based on the natural distribution patterns of trees and shrubs on different soils throughout Britain. Certain rarer species were not recommended for planting as their distribution patterns are of intrinsic importance (e.g Small leaved -lime, Wild Service Tree). I read a grim description of tree species being able to persist along the edges of their natural distribution (long lived species can persist for decades under unfavourable conditions) as... “populations of the “living dead” which are in slow decline. To what degree we invest conservation efforts in these doomed populations is a critical question”.

    Monitoring the distribution and health of native species (“sentinels of change”) is more important than second- guessing what species will be more suitable?

    Which brings me onto the point of this reply – “look-alikes”. How much of a problem is the fact that many native plantings use material from abroad. I read that a many Field Maples Acer campestre are subspecies leiocarpum (which flowers a month earlier being from southern Europe). Areas planted with the native Dogwood Cornus sanguinea have been found to be C. australis from the Black and Caspian sea and C. koenigii from southern Russia and Wayfaring Tree Viburnum lantana mixed up with V. veitchii from China. To name but a few. It has been said that if these look-alikes function in the ecosystem in a similar way there is no problem. But if we are worried about how species will adapt/survive a fast changing environment don’t we need better information on what we are actually planting? Should we be more demanding from our suppliers about where the plant material has come from and should we be encouraging planting of true natives with the emphasis on monitoring and enabling a diverse system to adapt?

    Now I’m wondering if I chose the right rootstocks for my apples. Oh dear.
  • I think there has been a considerable amount of complacency with this issue - particularly the selling of stock for native provenance which simply isn't. The reality of swapping some species for a lookalike substitute can be very problematic and as Hamish stated the soil is a major factor, the foreign supplements can often do considerable damage to the soil micro organism ecosystem, and we will not see the damage until a much later date - as such these supplements could be potentially very damaging for a sustainable landscape. Stick to what is known and double check provenance continously.
    This problem is set to get worse - there is now at least one, (it used to be very reputable), nursery here in Cornwall which is selling fruit trees which are not true to type and is ignoring many guidelines with regards the sale of other ornamental - I was told that a whitebeam was actually a poplar by the owner. How I wish I could name and shame.
    As such I completely agree with Rubus - we should be asking questions, the general public should be asking questions too and there should be penalties imposed on those that are busy falsely selling before the flood of such people into the industry abates.
  • having seen first hand the damage and potential threat therefore to our native trees caused by Phytophora ramorum and Phytophora kernovii I am convinced that the need to protect our semi natural woodlands and all the new plantings carried out with indigneous species have to be protected firstly by way of controlling new species into the UK landscape. If not we may be faced with a double calamity - climate change as well as a pathogen wiping out the natives. We are currently working on an elm project, where in order to produce resistant species we have to look to foreign varieties; to do it right takes time and patience and far too often we see a new variety of ornamental plant rushed to the garden centre shelves without consideration. A classic recent arrival being the invasive Leycesteria formosa, which is already starting to become a problem.
    The FC and Defra to be fair have been hot on this subject and there has been levelled criticism towards elements of the Horticultural and Landscape Architecture industry in response - again this criticism falls flat when set against a disjointed industry and as with Swine Flu the results are that mitigation is the only weapon.
  • In many respects nature will decide this one. There are many more areas of land which are being left redundant and it is interesting to watch what is happening on these patches. In most cases the colonisation is the same as for the natural history of the UK. But the closer to urban areas you are seeing many more non natives. But these are usually not the baddies and have been highlighted, particularly in the 'Flora Brittanica' book by Richard Mabey as being really quite beneficial to the biodiversity of areas which would support little else. Buddleia being a classic.

    Certainly as and when planting is required I agree with the above in so far that for now it is best to stick to natives and to ensure provenance. but owners of these plantings have to be made more aware of the essential maintenance required in the long term to ensure the risks of disease or non native invasion does not occur.
  • 'was hoping to start a discussion on what peoples views/experiences are with regards to planting trees and indeed all plants and the issue of a changing climate.'

    Well if I find the idiot who keeps planting trees on our estate without bothering to even consult us I will happily hang them from the nearest tree that would take their weight.

    Personally I look forward to reducing the number of trees we have, and bringing in a more diverse range which are much friendlier, both in terms of diversity and management.

    I am no expert, but where I live much of the land is paved, cemented over etc, with wonderful systems in place to capture and remove rain, so only a small percentage is captured by the earth. Most of the open area we have is topsoil, earth with a wonderful bed of rocks and rubble. Under all this is wonderful London Clay.

    Added to this was 169 wonderful large trees, plus a few that have been added. Some far too close to each other, others planted in raised flower beds.

    As I said I'm not expert, but would assume as living organisms they require a good deal of water/moisture.

    So heavily developed area, great system for moving water away from the area, and great lunking trees competing for the water available. Might explain why we have so many cracks in walls?

    By no means do I want to get rid of all the large trees, and by careful selection of relevant tree they will be able to grow much more naturally than they currently are. I would like to see a bit more diversity in our trees, both in character but also in supporting a more diverse wildlife.
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