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  Debbie Carroll August 5, 2010 at 6:07pm

  I was fortunate to get a 2nd hand pack of Vector works cheaper and have learnt to use it quite well and would not be without it now. I would love to upgrade to get better rendering & plant data but costs seem to be still marketed as if Garden designers all work in practices like Architects. As most Designers are one man operations the costs are often prohibative.
  
  I am now trying to get to grips, badly at the moment, with Sketch up so I can do some of my freer concept work and rendering on that.
  
  With any of these packages it all takes time to learn but is often worth the effort.
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  Keith Barker August 6, 2010 at 8:08am

  We use Adobe Illustrator and Photoshop for 2D and Sketchup for 3D.
  
  We have Vectorworks but hardly ever use it - it's too complex and expensive to keep updated.
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  Steve Rice August 6, 2010 at 11:45am

  I'm a big Vectorworks fan! Some 3 years ago I was hand-drawing and using Sketchup for some 3D design ideas work, then did a training course in VW and bought the software with a "windfall" inheritance. I have to confess that getting proficient (i.e. being able to use it quickly & effectively) with VW does need practice, and, as a designer/builder, I always seemed to be under too much time pressure to put in the effort. Eventually, I used a "quiet" period to re-work some of my hand-drawn designs, and started to apppreceiate the benefits of being able to reprint to differing scales, not worry about labelling errors ruining hours of work, showing/hiding different aspects of the design (e.g. survey / zone plan / hardscape / planting / etc) simply by turning on/off (or greying out) VW layers/classes and printing, rather than having to re-draw each aspect of the design. It took me a while to "let go" of sketchup for 3D work, as, initially, I thought VW 3D was too complex - but - take a look at Tamsin Slatter's brilliant book "Residential Garden Design with Vectorworks Landmark" (click this link for my review) which guides you there from being a complete novice. Now, all my work is 3D - it lets me show my clients what the garden will look like from any angle / position; I can explore sun & shade, do "what if" evaluations of features, sizes of trees, etc, and I've even moved on to making short "walk through" animations (click here for examples) where these add value to communicating the design ideas.
  
  Some people have said "its too complex", but look at it the other way around - it's supremely flexible!
  
  Steve Rice, Southampton.
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  Mike Swift August 6, 2010 at 4:01pm

  I would add VizTerra from Structured Studios to the list. I have been very impressed with the 2D and 3D capabilities. There is a long list of features on their web site to find out more. You can get a free trial download to try it. Also, it is priced on a subscription basis; monthly or yearly with no contract. The overall price is not out of line with other top end design packages.
  
  Periodically, they also offer free online training courses. You have to watch their web site or get on their mailing list to find out about them.
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  Jacqueline Prout August 8, 2010 at 4:41pm

  I have been using Vectorworks for about 5 years now, I was at an advantage having been a graphic designer before so I was well used to using graphics packages. I signed up to a cheap 10 week course at my local horticultural college, I actually ended up showing the lecturer a few things but I did learn quite a bit as well. The benefits of the course were really that I had a specific time in the diary to learn the software, I could have learnt as much with a software book but needless to say I would probably never have found the time to actually do it. I was also able to purchase the software for just £150 as a student limited period licence which I then upgraded when I was happy that it was the right software for me. The plant database us a bit clunky and could be so much better so I don't really use it, but then I very rarely use a planting plan as I don't see the point of them. I have downloaded the free Sketch-Up software but really couldn't get anywhere with it don't think I even managed to draw a basic 2D garden.
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  David Beasley Garden Design August 10, 2010 at 7:45am

  I can't comment on Vectorworks as I've never used it, but as far as I know I think you can not compare Vectorworks (Landmark?) side-by-side with SketchUp. Vectorworks is a 2D & 3D package purposely designed (aledgedly) for use by Landscape Architects/Garden Designers whilst SketchUp is a 3D only package designed for use by everyone from school children through to rocket scientists!
  
  All I will say is that most disciplines related to Garden Design and Landscaping etc. i.e. Architecture, Civil Engineering, Interior Design and Product Design the 'Industry Standard' CAD/Graphic packages are AutoCAD, 3D Studio Max, SketchUp and Photoshop. In general I would say that these professions are a lot more 'professional' and organised than 'we' are in their 'Work Flow' so I don't think it's to stupid a suggestion to use the same software as they do and forget about industry specific software such as Vectorworks (Landmark).
  
  The above programs have been used by professionals for years now and they are all highly compatibly with each other, have huge on-line support forums and cheap/free clone software equivalents are easily available. Also, you may be hard pressed to find a Vectorworks training/college course outside of, say, London whilst most local colleges nationally will offer 'night classes' in AutoCAD and Photoshop. SketchUp is so easy to learn that with a bit of dedicated time and practice you can easily teach yourself via. it's help option, online tutorials, Youtube videos and books etc.
  
  Each of the programs I have mentioned has a specific use in the 'Work Flow' of producing a garden design and they are as follows:
  
  AutoCAD/DoubleCAD XT/ProgeCAD (basically any program that produces DWG or DXF files!)
  
  Used from the beginning to draw up the survey and work up the layout for the design in 2D. Also best used to produce 'Planting Plans'.
  
  SketchUp
  
  Used to convert the 2D AutoCAD drawing into 3D by adding the 'z' axis. Output from SketchUp is fantastic for visualising the final garden as it gives you the options to populate your design with ready made 'components' such as people/plants/cars, photorealistic materials and shadow lines etc. SketchUp models can be printed off directly from SketchUp, made into animations, exported as JPEGS or exported directly into other software (such as renderers) to add more detail.
  
  Photoshop
  
  Great for 'colouring in' black and white 2D AutoCAD drawings. Also best used to bring SketchUp drawings 'to life' by adding 'depth of field' and 'lens flares' etc.
  
  I also have the feeling that most Garden Design courses/schools seem to be 'in cahoots' with Vectorworks and produce students who are loyal to this program without really knowing the capabilities of the other programs. In the long-term I think this will put these designers at a disadvantage when they start to work with other professions who do not use Vectorworks.
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  Rose Lennard August 13, 2010 at 8:44am

  I use Sketchup for design, 3D models, masterplans, setting out, construction details (drawn separately, not taken from the masterplan) and bases for planting plans. For some masterplans I print onto tracing and hand finish to make it prettier. Presentation is pretty basic compared to some of the more sophisticated graphics packages out there, though I appreciate there are add-ons I could investigate. Sketchup is invaluable for allowing clients to visualise and buy into the design, and especially useful for enclosed spaces and changes of level in hard landscape areas. I haven't got into using the sandbox and find it less useful for large gardens with undulating levels. I do try to spend some time designing freehand at the drawing board as I'm wary that otherwise my designs will be be limited to the shapes and styles that Sketchup does best - orthogonal, push-pull blocks!
  Currently trying to find the time to trial Keyscape which is CAD based, for planting plans. Anyone got any views on how Vectorworks and Keyscape compare? Both pricey but I reckon I will have to invest in one or the other soon.
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  Debbie Carroll August 13, 2010 at 2:00pm

  I have successfully imported drawings from both Architects and Survey companies into my vector works & while I haven't explorted them back believe this is more than possible.
  
  
  
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  Bigyin December 28, 2010 at 11:18pm

  Why don't you have a poke around here.

  http://sketchup.google.com/intl/en_uk/
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  Bigyin December 28, 2010 at 11:24pm

  There's also a lot of stuff from LJN members here:-

   http://www.landscapejuicenetwork.com/group/usersofgooglesketchupfor...