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I'm looking for advice on how you would all deal with this situation.I had looked after all of the maintenance needs of a small hilltop estate in Ayrshire for a Lady for 2 years. She was extremely satisfied with everything we did, how we went about doing it, and took great pleasure in her garden and grounds. However she sold it to a chap who had plans to develop it. She gave him my details and told him to contact me once things started to grow again after the winter....so he called me... after the grass had grown to the point where it resembled a field. He wanted a bowling green. I explained to him that we wouldn't cut it right down straight away but would lower it every week to try to meet his requirements. I verbally agreed £150 per cut, with all clippings collected etc. While on our 3rd visit he called me and complained that the first cut was not tidy enough and therefore said he wouldn't pay for it. I told him he would and then settled that he'd give me £100 of it. I left it at that, finished the job and left thinking that he was just at it, a little bit of a shark, nut that he would, after reasoning, pay for a job honestly and well done.I went back the following week did another cut but didn't lift the grass and would charge an hourly rate for reduced time taken. This man called me up this morning a told me that because he didn't ask me to cut it again that, despite our verbal agreement, he would not pay me for it and that I should learn from this... learn not to trust people!?!?? I am a trusted person and don't find this easy to accept.Where do I stand on this? Do I have a comeback. It's only £150. It's a principle matter for me though.What would you do?

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  • PRO
    Neil

    I definitely feel you have a contract although there is going to be a difference of opinion on the details of that contract between you and the client.

    I can give you a real example of a similar situation - call me on 00 44 844 232 4221 for a chat to suit you.

    Regards


    Phil
  • My view would be that having renegotiated the price for the first cut, you should have clarified exactly what the ongoing terms were to be, if any (ie, if he wanted you to do any more at all, and if so, exactly what, and at what price).

    A verbal contract is legally binding, but in this case I don't think there was a very clear understanding of what had been agreed, so I doubt that you have much of a legal case.

    Do you really want to continue working for this man anyway? Personally, I'd just walk....
  • PRO
    I should have added to my original post that it is always best to put everything in writing. Having a simple set of terms and conditions available is essential.

    http://www.landscapejuice.com/2007/07/creating-good-l.html
  • Have to agree with Phil. We will not do a single thing without a signed contract in place. If any aspect changes, so should the contract and that means a rewrite for which you make it known from the offset that there is a charge for.

    The UK has a huge blame culture for some reason it is always someone else's fault. There are too many thieves out there who bitch and wriggle to get out of any aspect. In the past we have had people change their minds about aspects of projects and not bother telling us until the end and then complain that we have not done the job to their satisfaction. At first this used to really hurt me, nowadays I'll take anyone to court at the drop of a hat, I'm sick of people with this type of mentality.

    I would also get in contact with a good and reliable debt collection agency and make sure that you have a solicitor that you can call on.
    • BTW Happy to put you in contact with debt collectors and solicitors, if you ever need them.
  • PRO
    Editable Terms and conditions for your landscape business.
    There is a link at the bottom of this post to a word document taht you can download to your own computer.

    I accept no responsibility for them and if in doubt, seek legal advice before putting them into use.

    I thought you might be interested in a set of terms and conditions that I have created which you are more than welcome to edit and utilise for your own business.

    They are not exhaustive and there may be items which I have not considered and may be unique to your project.

    Example - You may be asked to remove and old lawn and create a new one. On inspection you note that the grass is very weak and yellow in colour on part of the lawn and you suspect that there may have been a building or a parking area in the past.

    There will be a specific need to insert a special condition on your T&C's which highlights this to your client.

    After all, you do not want to be the one to carry the can if the new lawn fails or your client fails to realise that there may be a problem in the first place.

    ---------------------------

    Special Condition - insert your business name here - Has noted that the grass condition in an area of approximately 20 square metres adjacent to the patio is of poor quality. Provision has been made for a depth of 150mm of fresh top soil. We reserve the right to charge, as extra, for extra material and labour costs at a rate pro rata to that provided for in the contract, should it be deemed necessary to excavate further than the specified depth and infill with further top soil

    --------------------------

    Take plenty of photographs of the site that is to be landscaped or altered and make notes about specific featured. If you see an anomaly like and a line in the lawn that might indicate settlement of a drainage trench or service such as an electric cable then you must draw the attention of your client to it both verbally and as a point of note in the T&C's.

    After all, if you are not informed by it's presence and you have taken all reasonable steps to identify it, you do not want to be financially liable for any problems that may be caused during the work.

    An example might read:

    Insert your business name here is not able to accept responsibility for any damage to (or cost involved with) any underground hazards, obstructions or services not made known to us in writing or apparent on visual inspection.
    • Many thanks.

      I'm to go and collect some money he owes me later in week so will try to ammicably settle the rest. If he refuses, well I'll walk away.

      Get this though! He's now poached one of my boys who will do the work for a fraction and has left me high and dry. It really sickens me.

      Thanks Philip for the T&C's though. I will certainly put them to good use from now on.
  • It seems to be getting worse re people not paying for work that has been done.

    It has happened to me on 2 occasions now i wont bore you with the details, but the contracts were both worth a couple of hundred pounds each and were done to a high standard in my opinion.

    The people in qustion just refused to pay. So one day i told another one of my customers who was a soliciter the problems i was having and was told to take them to the small claims court.

    Cutting a long story short the solicitor said once the the 1st maybe 2nd letter gets sent from your solicitor they nearly always back down, Which thankfully on both occasions they did.

    Its my opinion that the high flyers of this world try it on because they know they can get away with it.
  • PRO
    If it is of any consolation to anyone, I only had two bad debts in my 21 years.

    One of them was a small building company that went bust in the late eighties owing £100. (there was a happy ending here when one of the directors paid me out of his own pocket three years later).

    The second was the 52nd richest man in the UK ( I won't mention his name) who took umbridge because I removed a eleagnus ebengii hedge after taking instructions from his Portuguese manager at the house.

    It was a communication problem but I lost out - I was 25 years of age but I never let it happen again and used T&C's and written spec's etc always after.
  • PRO
    I hear this so often Martin.

    Invariably, one a solicitors letter hits the doormat - unless there are genuine financial problems - the customer soon gets a little nervous and pays up.

    I am pleased you are busy. I think that because you have decided to remain under the VAT threshold, it gives you great scope pick and choose.

    Larger companies take longer to change course if there is a bit of a blip in trading.
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