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PRO

Turfing Problem

Hey Guys & Gals,

Recently been to look at a lawn for client/family friend which was laid by somebody else last March - grew perfectly well the first year, started to look rubbish over the winter and is now in a really poor state and is not growing at all.

I have attached a few pics of the site.

For some background info, before this was a lawn the whole area was laid to crazy paving with a few small borders (had been this way for 20years plus). I am told that there was a considerable depth 6-8inches of concrete which the paving was laid on.

The installing contractor removed all (ok...most) of the paving and concrete, rotavated the soil underneath, laid a thin dusting of what I will assume was soil conditioner and laid the turf.

This year the grass has not grown at all and is not even high enough to warrant cutting. There is a lot of dead thatch present which I know I can scarify, but I feel there is something bigger going on that is causing the grass not to grow. It is very stony underneath in places (though not in others) and is hard to put a spade in when digging which leaves me to feel compaction/lack of air may be a cause (maybe the area was not rotavated as well as it could have been).

I will also be sending of a soil sample for analysis to see what that brings up but wondered if any of you lawn guys had any ideas?

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  • PRO

    The lawn would benefit from aeration a good scarify and feed.

  • I think it's as simple as looking at the first picture. There are rolling, open fields, all sloping down-hill to the site?

    As I said in the other lawn thread last week, grass that's sat under water will have suffered, as we've had the wettest winter on record. Why that's an issue is twofold: too free-draining, or not draining enough.

    The soil looks fine from the pics. If it's a lawn laid from turf last year, it should have enough nutrients in the first 20mm, but grass only ever uses the first 40-50mm of soil.

    What matters are the underlying conditions. I'd guess that the site either drains freely, which lots of rubble does suggest, in which case the soil will have been washed of any goodness. If it's been water-logged for three months, then it's the roots dying off.

  • it looks dry to me.

    was probably wet as exposed area all winter. is that some moss?

    how have they mowed it? could be mulched causing thatch / no light&air.

    whatever you do it may be the same next year.

    id use a good liquid fertiliser /maxi-crop turf conditioner (yellow one inc moss killer) strengthen roots of grass with seaweed its main purpose.

    and - mow properly fortnightly. ?

  • 1, was ok last year because it was just putting roots down, give it a tug in various areas and ensure it has rotted, shouldn't lift up. Try and slice a bit back with a spade and check the roots.
    2, check for leather jackets/chaffer grub, wet a 1x1mtr area at night, lay a black bag with some weight on over night, lift in the morning and see what has come up. Needs some warmth to draw bugs up.
    3, looks like it is cut short, try and leave for a couple weeks while you sort problem
    4, contact contractor and get him to sort problem.
    Call me if needed
  • Always difficult to analyse from pictures but in general everything looks OK. The issue I feel is with lack of available nutrients in the soil. A good feed now and then again in 6 weeks should help.

  • Simon did the soil analysis reveal any problems?. I have a similar lawn that was lay over a patio which we had to relay as the previous contractor had not removed the patio (I know). Anyway after removing said patio, rotovating and bringing in a lot of top soil and relaying, the lawn looked much improved. Strangely though the area where the patio was closes to the surface of the grass still shows as a lighter shade. I assumed it was because there was a higher sand content in the soil so the nutrients where being washed away? Anyway a nitrogen and iron treatment made a great improvement but if needed I would scarify and over seed in Sept as I believe the situation was made worse by all the rain. Hope this helps - Good Luck

  • PRO
    Thanks all for your replies.

    Soil analysis sent off this week so it will be interesting what the results throw up.

    Turf checked for pests - none present
    Mowing too close - good suggestion but not in this case. The surface of the lawn is really bad with lumps and bumps all over the place (you would never know it was a newly laid lawn!)so the owners couldn't cut it too short as they would be scalping it all over the place!

    My intention is not to rubbish another contractor but the impression I get is that said company got their estimate way out with removing the old crazy paving and found they were in danger of making a big loss with this one. Rather than be honest with the client I think they may have cut corners to finish the job. Some areas of crazy paving were not removed at all and I really question how much rotavating was done.

    If the soil sits under paving for 20 years plus I would guess that the soil nutrients would be pretty depleted. Is this really going to be rectified with granular or liquid feeds? Or are they going to act as a bit of a temporary fix and what it would really need is relaying with fresh top soil brought in??

    I appreciate it's hard to say without viewing the lawn in person!
  • In the case of the lawn that we had to relay we first checked by using a reinforcing bar and probing the soil. We were hitting stone all over so we excavated a small area and there was the patio. When we removed the turf with a cutter there were bricks sitting right under the grass. We removed all the stone with a bar and brought in top soil to replace the stonework and level the lawn. Rotovated and relaid with new turf. It was an expensive job but otherwise it would have never been right. I included a statement in the quote which stated the the price was dependant on what we found under the ground and the client was happy to pay the extra.

  • PRO
    Thanks Jon. I'm hoping that it doesn't have to be relaid (for the owners sake) but there is a good chance that it will as it sounds a similar situation to what you have experienced with your situation. Thanks for your input mate


    Jonathan Grayfox said:

    In the case of the lawn that we had to relay we first checked by using a reinforcing bar and probing the soil. We were hitting stone all over so we excavated a small area and there was the patio. When we removed the turf with a cutter there were bricks sitting right under the grass. We removed all the stone with a bar and brought in top soil to replace the stonework and level the lawn. Rotovated and relaid with new turf. It was an expensive job but otherwise it would have never been right. I included a statement in the quote which stated the the price was dependant on what we found under the ground and the client was happy to pay the extra.

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